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Rewatch S8: 8x16 Remember the Titans

Okay! Another rewatch time...

This one, I remember as being QUITE a stand-alone MOTW, so hopefully this is a short one.

We start with a sleepy driver who is totally going to kill some guy - and he does. And then he just DRIVES AWAY, way to be responsible asshat. Mind you, don't know what I'd do in that situation, I'm not the most ethical person on the planet, but I DO like to think of myself as chaotic or neutral good, even if I'm not lawful.

(Unrelated sidenote: I do this thing when I'm typing things quickly, where I write words that sound vaguely like the word I want, rather than the actual word I want. Basically, homonyms or near-homonyms. Right instead of write, or here instead of hear...you get the picture. Those are pretty common though, I also do some that aren't so common - don't instead of doubt... anyone who has ever betaed anything for me, or hell, anyone probably even reading these posts knows exactly what I'm talking about. Anyway, this is all a big preamble to say that in the above paragraph, instead of writing "driver", I wrote "driving her"... and I think that officially makes the list as the strangest near-homonym mistake that I've ever made. I wrote two words instead of one and it BARELY sounds the same. I mean, really. I'm ridiculous.)

I have to say that Prometheus is one of my favourite myths. I like how they added the eagle pecking out his liver. It's a nice touch.

Sam's wearing a shirt that originally appeared in S3, I believe.

And Sam spits up blood... it's pretty sad that his first reaction (after shock) is to quickly make sure that no one saw and then hide the evidence.

Dean: "What's up with you?"
Sam: "Nothing. Why?"
Dean: "Heard from Kevin?"

- I love how Dean knows IMMEDIATELY that something is up with Sam, but then lets it go. Also, second appearance of Dean's Dead Guy Robe - and yes, I'm making an If Clothes Could Talk entry for it.

Dean: "So, no word from Cas; Kevin's taking his sweet little time; and you're acting cagey. We need to leave before I start climbing these walls."
- Again, I just love the fact that Dean doesn't accept Sam's "nothing" as the truth. I love Sam's helpless look, like "ah come on man! Let me lie to you!"

Off to investigate a case...

I love how the Sheriff is all about the zombies... it's a nice reverse on the usual.

Dean: "I gotta say, I am a little disappointed."
Sam: "Yeah, because you wanted to shoot zombies!"
Dean: "Damn straight I wanted to shoot zombies!"

- The zombies they could shoot were only the ones created by Death in S5, all the other zombies they've had to stake into the ground.
- Anyway, I love this exchange regardless.

I love how Prometheus wakes up while their chatting and then they turn and he's gone. Brilliant.

Prometheus: "...I don't know who I am. All I know is all I do is die. So if you're going to shoot me, shoot me. Just promise me you'll finish the job because I can't do this anymore."
- I love this introduction to the character. I also love Sam's face - Sam's been in a time-loop involving death before, so my headcanon is that he pretty much knows exactly what Prometheus is talking about.

Oh, Prometheus' name is Shane... I'm going to keep calling him Prometheus.

I'm not really talking that much about the exposition. There's not much to say... we all know the plot in this one.

Oh! Artemis has shown up! In leather! Man, I love leather.

Prometheus: "Who are you?"
Artemis: "You don't remember? Nevermind."
*tries to kill him*

- I really like the switch in Artemis, because this is our first sign that they had something. She's gentle with him until she discovers that he doesn't remember her and THAT flips the switch into kill mode. All these years she's been protecting someone she loves, but with his amnesia, well, that's basically the same as the man Artemis loved being dead - at least to Artemis. To her, they were there shared experience, and now that doesn't exist for him - he's someone knew.
- Note: I will talk about the romantic-plot line for Artemis and how it's not appropriate for her mythologically speaking later.

Oh, I didn't notice when I watched this before that Prometheus throws Artemis into a wall with super strength... that's a neat little addition to the mystery, even if it's blink and you miss it. Well, that being said, just the fact that he can fight so well is a big red flag, so I guess it's just icing on the cake really.

Prometheus: "Who are you?"
Artemis: "Now? I'm your worst enemy."

- Again, what I said above.
- I love the fade-away she does. It's exactly how I picture the characters in my fantasy novel doing it... man, I should actually write that thing instead of just thinking about it all the time, but right now it's a delicious story that's perfect in my head and I don't want to put it down on paper and make it imperfect.

Dean: "Is he having a heart attack?!"
Sam: "Do we call 911?"
Dean: "And tell them what that the dead guy we stole from the morgue is alive and having a coronary?"

- Really, Sam and Dean shouldn't be too stressed about this, they KNOW he dies everyday. :P

Dean: "I feel like I'm sitting Shiva."
Sam: "That's not- Nevermind. We need to think..."

- I love when Dean mentions Jewish things because it fits with my headcanon of him, even if he mentions them somewhat inappropriately. :P

Sam: "...Dean, what do we know that has Jason Bourne fighting skills, dies a lot, and has a history with violent women?"
Dean: "I don't know. You?"

- Hehehe, it's funny because it's true. Also, I love Sam's face.

And then the knock... and the introduction of Prometheus' kid. An interesting twist.

*Dean accidentally opens the door wide*
*Haley sees Prometheus*
Dean: "Oh, you weren't supposed to see-"
Haley: "It's alright. Stay with the nice FBI agents, Oliver!"

-Hehehe, way to trust FBI agents blindly with your offspring.

More exposition - "mountain in Europe" - so vague... but I like the idea that it didn't necessarily have to be in Greece. It was just "a mountain' after all, not a specific one.

Haley: "...he had a heart attack [during sex]"
Dean: "Awkward"
Haley: "[...] I had to the morgue to identify the body-"
Sam: "He popped up again... alive."

- Oh my god, I just realized that Sam's pause before he says "alive" is because he realizes he just accidentally made an innuendo. We can't take EITHER of you boys anywhere, geez.

Sam: "Well, it looks like we were right about that curse thing. From what I can tell, we're looking at a titan."
- So cool.

Sam: "He Ocean11ed Mount Olympus and stole the flames of Olympia"
Dean: "For what? Kicks?"
Sam: "For us, actually. Zeus decided to revoke humanity's ability to make fire, so we couldn't cook, couldn't stay warm, couldn't see in the dark-"
Dean: "Sounds like a monster's paradise. And this guy made it right for us?"

- This makes me think of Purgatory - Dean knows what he's talking about.
- I also like the idea that Prometheus was an altruist - that he stole fire for humanity, because Zeus was killing them by denying them the use of it. It's nice.

Sam: "I'm guessing Artemis, Zeus' daughter, she's been known to carry around weapons like that dagger - they're nasty. They can kill immortals dead."
- So, I know it might be overreaching, but DAMN, why didn't they try to get their hands on one of Artemis' weapons? That would be SO USEFUL.

Dean: "I'm sorry, you just discovered that you have a 7 year-old son and you want to walk away?"
Prometheus: "And I'm a god! And this God and his daughter are hunting me, what choice do we have!"

- Dean is putting family in front of everything, but so is Prometheus... but we'll get to that later.

Haley: "He fell."
"Do I need to call an ambulance"
Haley: "No, it's fine."
Prometheus: "He's dying."
Haley: "I was going to tell you. I just wanted you to have time to adjust."
Sam: "Wait a second, he has your curse?!"
Haley: "What curse?"

- Um, Haley, your kid dies everyday, did you think it was an illness? Because I'm pretty sure you went looking for your crazy dying-everyday ex-boyfriend rather than taking your kid to the doctor.

So, they rush into the bunker like the kid's fall JUST happened, and start asking them questions... but Sam and Dean have changed outfits and they've all driven hundreds of miles... so, um, yeah, the sense of urgency is a little bit misguided in this scene, I believe.

Haley: "It started when he turned seven a few months ago. It started with the dying and then he stopped talking-"
Sam: "Wait, seven?! Age seven marks one of the first Greek rights of manhood."

- I think I had some ancient history scholars tell me that this is technically wrong, but I don't care. I like it.
- Also, I love the excuse not to have to write lines for the kid or worry too much about the kids ability to act.

Haley: "...but we have a child and whatever you have, he has. I need to know how to stop it. What curse?"
- Lady, don't you think if Shane knew how to stop it he would have by now? Also, didn't you just drive hundreds of miles together? You couldn't have asked then? Or did they drive separately and Shane chatted with Sam and Dean in the Impala the whole way while Haley followed behind with her dead kid?

Haley: "...and you guys are ghostbusters?"
Dean: "Wow, well, due to the fact that your son is currently, albeit temporarily dead, I'm going to let that one slide."

- Note: Dean does not like being called a ghostbuster. :P

Prometheus is wearing my shirt! Or rather, Dean's shirt... that I now own. And it still has it's collar buttons, so it might actually be the shirt that I actually own. Dean's version had the collar buttons removed, from what I could tell... I should check my other screen caps of it, but I don't actually care that much... I'll do it when I have the time. :P

Dean: "So, the way this usually works is we summon the bastard and then work him over until he undoes whatever it is he did."
Haley: "Summon Zeus?"
Dean: "Yeah."
Haley: "And if he doesn't do it?"
Sam: "Then we take him out."
Dean: "And hopefully the curse dies along with him,"

- As foolish as I think this plan is, I DO kind of admire Dean and Sam for kind of just...following their modus operendi regardless.

Research montage! Sorry, I love research montages, because it's kind of rare that you see them on TV, and it's what I used to do in University. (Even though I technically have "research" job right now, it's actually a data entry job involving historical documents, there's no actual research/critical-thinking/discovery involved which is why my job is so mindnumbingly boring.)

Dean: "...and the Men of Letters translated his journal."
Prometheus: "The Men of Letters?"
Dean: "It's a secret society, this is actually their lair...we're legacies....no big deal."

-Hehehe, he's so proud. He's talking to a PROTO-GOD!

Folgerite is now found in gem shops instead of being a rare item that you have to steal from rich people. Convenient! :P

Prometheus: "Why're you doing this, Sam?"
Sam: "We need a bone, so I dig."
Prometheus: "No, I mean, for us. This isn't your problem. You're risking your life."
Sam: "Why'd you risk yours to steal that fire?"
Prometheus: "Good question. Wish I could remember."
Sam: "Trust me on this, it was worth it. You pretty much, uh, saved the whole world."
Prometheus: "Yeah, I guess, but none of that - none of that means anything unless I can save my son."

- Again, we have Sam reiterating that Prometheus basically saved humanity once - (just like Sam!). Oh, note: I'm glad Sam got some one-on-one time with a guest character in this episode, it's seriously rare, I find.
- Prometheus though says that it doesn't mean anythig unless he can save his son - he's putting family before the world, here, really. If he can't save his son, then saving the world doesn't mean anything... and I can't help but think of Dean basically doing the same thing with Sam at the end of the season. Sam can close the gates of hell, but if it kills him too, then it doesn't mean anything to Dean - it's not a victory. SAM is more important than the world. Which, of course, we knew from S2, when Sam died and Dean didn't care about the world ending anymore... it makes Swan Song all the more powerful really, the fact that Dean let Sam sacrifice himself once upon a time.

You know, I wish Prometheus was just a TAD less surfer-boy, but I like Zeus.

Haley fails to bluff.

*Zeus blasts Sam and Dean into a wall*
Dean: "Balls!"

- Bobby-ism! He lives on in the hearts of his adopted boys!

Zeus: "...I must admit, I could never have conceived such a horrible fate for such a beautiful child. Just goes to show, we must all leave room for happy accident." [...] "Tell me, has Prometheus experienced the child's death yet? How did he take it? Did he hurt? Good. Imagine a thousand children, all dying in unison, only then would you understand my pain."
- I don't get this line really... why did Prometheus giving humans fire kill a thousand of Zeus' children? Zeus didn't make monsters... at least, I don't think he did. It's all very odd.

Sam: "Do you know who this is, Dean, walking us to our deaths?"
Dean: "Don't know, don't care."
Sam: "It's our god. The goddess of hunters."
Dean: "That's fascinating."
Sam: "See, she's who we'd pray to for courage when hunting the gorgon or the minotaur, 'course, she's not really worship worthy anymore, having lost the st[inaudible to me] and all."
*Artemis slams them into the wall*
Artemis: "The hell I have!"
Dean: "Really, Sam, you're trash-talking a god, seriously?"

- I like this. I like that Sam realizes the advantage in the fact that she's supposed to be THEIR God.

Sam: "Still at full power? Then why'd it take you seven years to find Prometheus?"
Artemis: "He was hiding."
Sam: "Hiding? Really? So the god of hunters couldn't find a shack in Montana? Maybe it is that you didn't want to find him."

- I know a lot of people took issue with the fact that they gave Artemis a love-story when Artemis traditionally is against them completely and yeah, I understand that... but I DO like Sam putting it all together and talking his way out of the situation like a badass.

So, um, quick archery critique - if Artemis is the goddess of hunters, she should be using a hunting stance - she's not. For the olympic target-shooting stance, which I assume is the one that she's going for, she's turned too much towards the front. Her bow arm is too straight. Her release-hand isn't anchored. She's shaking when she releases the arrow. There is no way in hell that arrow would have found it's target.

Anyway, um, back to actual dialogue...

Zeus: "I am doing this for us. For our kind. He is the reason we're here and not ruling the world. He is the reason they have forgotten all about us!"
- See, THIS makes sense and is actually pretty awesome. Because in giving humans fire, Prometheus gave them the means to defend THEMSELVES, meaning that they were freed from their reliance on the mercy of the gods. I think that's brilliant.

Artemis: "You were once my father. Now you're someone else."
- Again, we come back to Artemis' believe that once someone changes, the person they were is dead and she no longer has to honour any love or ties to them. It's pretty interesting from a philosophical point of view. Someone I know once dated a guy that they loved, but he eventually started doing cocaine, amongst other drugs, and started to become abusive... at first she stayed, thinking that part of her duty as his girlfriend was to be loyal and try to get him to change back to who he had been... but then she realized that she loved and had agreed to date WHO HE HAD BEEN. She didn't love and hadn't agreed to date who he had become. So instead she broke it off... which I think was the much better decision. One the other hand, let's say your partner gets amnesia, or suffers from a brain injury that changes their personality just slightly... do you not still love them? Are they technically a different person? I don't know... it's interesting.

And the old human-shield trick.

Zeus: "I never get tied of watching you die. Your boy is going on the mountain."
*Prometheus drives the arrow through his body killing Zeus along with him.*

- Always a good plan to take someone with you when you die... uh, someone that deserves to die, that is. Also, Prometheus effectively uses his last death to save his son, thus making the whole saving-the-world thing worth it.

Artemis only takes Zeus after looking at Haley.
- I like this moment. I mean, Artemis has already decided that HER Prometheus is dead and that this man belongs to Haley now... but yeah, actually leaving him for Haley is an act of compassion that's a nice touch.

I do wonder about what sort of power-vacuum is left on Olympus now, because I'm pretty sure Lucifer killed some Greek gods too back in 5x18, though I could be wrong. I don't really remember who all was there.

Haley: "I'm sorry."
Dean hugs her.

- I kind of wonder what she's apologizing for here - not going along with the bluff? I guess... I guess she's apologizing for screwing it all up. Personally, I've always been of the opinion that once your mistake has caused someone you love to die, you don't have to apologize for it - you've already been punished and we all know you're sorry. My mother doesn't agree with me. We once got into a big argument because a kid accidentally killed four of his friends by driving recklessly (possibly under the influence? I don't remember. It was when I was a teen). My mom was sympathizing with the mourning mothers and thought the kid should be thrown in jail forever - and I had the audacity to point out that for the rest of his life, he'll know that he killed his four friends and that was the worst punishment that I could possibly think of and I didn't think he needed more on top of that. I thought maybe he'd need a suicide watch, because I couldn't fathom living with that knowledge. Anyway, yeah, like I said, argument ensued, I think I conceded quickly, because I hate arguments and tend to agree just to end them.

Sam: "You know what, how about we go get some ice-cream Sundays."
Oliver: "No, I'd like to stay."

- This is like the creepiest scene. I have no idea what they meant to accomplish with it. Sam being awkward "so the dad you just met is now dead and you're scarred for life...ice cream?" Kid being... uh, mature? Able to recognize that now is not the appropriate time for ice-cream? Also, what did Sam think he was going to do, just drive off with the kid while Haley and Dean watched Prometheus burn? "Hey, not kidnapping your son, just inappropriately taking him out for ice-cream."

Sam: "You know, I'm starting to think, maybe I was being naive."
Dean: "What are you talking about?"
Sam: "When I thought I could just will myself to come out of these trials unscathed."
Dean: "No, no, stop with the sullen emo crap. You're not going to die like Prometheus."
Sam: "How do you know, Dean? Bobby, Rufus, now Prometheus, do you think any of them chose death? No. The life chose for them."

- Uh, Prometheus wasn't a hunter, Sam. Also, I think this is a BIT of a stretch to think you're going to die just because a dude who died every day finally died permanently.
- Okay, that being said, a couple of episodes ago I did talk about how I think Sam's willingness to die, or belief that he HAD to die and his acceptance of that, was a gradual thing that happened in these last few 8 episodes or so. I think it ties in with the fact that Sam's getting sicker, that he's FEELING worse... and it doesn't have that much to do with Prometheus dying for his son or whatever... I mean, we've all gotten the flu at some point and thought that it might possibly kill us this time, even though it's statistically unlikely. Being sick fucks with your brain... and I think the first thing it does is kind of mess with your ability to believe you'll be able to survive it.

Dean: "Yeah, well, you promised! You promised to live a long Clark Griswald life full of prostate exams and colonoscopies, alright. You're not welshing on that deal, not on my watch. If you die, it's going to be because of something normal."
Sam: "Like a heart attack?"
Dean: "Exactly! Yeah, eat your burger."

- I kind of think it's heartbreaking how Dean says, "you promised!" it's such... a little kid thing to say. Also, Dean is so adament that Sam get old... that's all Dean wants is for Sam to reach old age. It's so simple and yet so unlikely.
- Also, I think Sam says "like a heart attack" because they had JUST seen Prometheus die from a supernatural heart-attack the day before... but that being said, I love the joke with the burger, like Dean's already laying the goundwork for his dream to come true. Hehehe...

Dean took the weapons off his headboard wall! Weird bit of discontinuity there.

Dean: "Cas, you got your ears on? Listen, you know I am not one for praying, because in my book it's the same as begging. But this is about Sam, so I need you to hear me. We are going into this thing blind, and I don't know what's ahead or what it's going to bring for Sam. Now, he's covering pretty good, but I know that he's hurting, and this one was supposed to be on me. So for all that we've been through, I'm asking you, you keep a lookout for my little brother, okay? Where the hell are you, man?"
- Dean assigns his guardian angel to his brother... my feelings! Also, we hear again how it was "supposed to be on [Dean]"... it was Dean's plan to ride high off his victory over purgatory and take it right into the fight against hell. It was Dean's plan that if he died, it wouldn't matter, because Sam had already demonstrated that he was able to move on after Dean's death... and Dean knows that he's not. Sigh, poor Dean.
- That being said, of course, I think the beginning of S8 was OOC for Sam and that there is no way in hell the Sam that I know could have lived without Dean, not in any sort of happy way. I still maintain that it would have made MUCH more sense for Sam and Amelia's storyline to sort of be a 500 days of Summer thing, where Sam saw the fantasy due to his PTSD and mental-instability issues, but the reality was far different. That's always going to be my headcanon when it comes to S8, I don't even care what actually aired.
- And we also, of course, get worry for Cas in this scene. Dean has two people he cares most about, and one of them is hurting and losing faith in himself and trying to hide it... and the other is missing after returning to heaven, after he once said that if he returned to heaven he might kill himself. Meanwhile, Dean, who was supposed to be the bad-ass hunter who victoriously slammed the gates of hell is left to fret on the sidelines and basically the only thing he CAN do is worry. He's like the star of the football team with a broken leg... only the football game carries the possibility of death if they don't win.

And with that really weird analogy, my work here is done.

Tune in next time (sometime on the weekend?) when Castiel returns with the plot for the next episode...

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Comments

( 9 comments — Leave a comment )
borgmama1of5
Jan. 10th, 2014 10:03 am (UTC)
This was a weird little filler episode...I wonder how moments like Sam offering to take Oliver for ice cream get by everyone connected with the show. Doesn't anyone see it as odd? Everyone involved with the show thinks it's a perfectly normal line and all the viewers who are jarred by it are just nuts?

Oh wait...they are the same ones who had Sam not look for Dean...(guess I'm still bitter about that...)
hells_half_acre
Jan. 10th, 2014 05:37 pm (UTC)
:P I think everyone with any sense of Sam's character is still bitter about that...

But yeah, I do wonder sometimes - Maybe it read different on the page than it did on the screen? That seems far fetched. I honestly have no idea.
caranfindel
Jan. 10th, 2014 09:09 pm (UTC)
Regarding the fulgurite... The first time, when they went to so much trouble to get it, people pointed out that it's actually it that uncommon. So this actually makes more sense.
hells_half_acre
Jan. 10th, 2014 09:27 pm (UTC)
Yeah, that's what I figured. ;)

also, thanks for spelling it right - I'm so lazy, I didn't bother looking it up and just spelled it like I heard it.
caranfindel
Jan. 10th, 2014 09:29 pm (UTC)
Hah, you can thank autocorrect for that! :-)
supernutjapan
Jan. 11th, 2014 07:15 am (UTC)
Prometheus: "Yeah, I guess, but none of that - none of that means anything unless I can save my son."
- Again, we have Sam reiterating that Prometheus basically saved humanity once - (just like Sam!).


ooo, I like that connection!

I also love how you've connected Prometheus' first sacrificing himself for humanity then putting his son first to what Sam and Dean do in Season 5 and in Swan Song.

But, this question has been at the back of my head for a while - What makes Swan Song different from Season 5? Maybe the fact that in Season 5, Sam felt guilty for bringing Lucifer back in the first place? but Dean felt guilty for starting the Apocalypse too?? So is it because because they both felt they had to make things right? Dean sacrificed his need for Sam and Sam sacrificed himself for humanity?

Dean: "Really, Sam, you're trash-talking a god, seriously?"
- I like this. I like that Sam realizes the advantage in the fact that she's supposed to be THEIR God.


I think Dean is actually playing along with this. He may not know where Sam is going with it, but I think Dean is "acting" too.

Zeus: "I am doing this for us. For our kind. He is the reason we're here and not ruling the world. He is the reason they have forgotten all about us!"


I think this is also what he means in the previous statement about 1000 children dying. It's not actually the children dying, it is the "pain" that Zeus feels equaling 1000 children dying.

Being sick fucks with your brain... and I think the first thing it does is kind of mess with your ability to believe you'll be able to survive it.

Someone else pointed this out too, and I also believe that Sam's feelings of "letting Dean down" and Dean choosing others over him were part of that as well.

- I kind of think it's heartbreaking how Dean says, "you promised!" it's such... a little kid thing to say. Also, Dean is so adament that Sam get old... that's all Dean wants is for Sam to reach old age. It's so simple and yet so unlikely.

I guess Dean wants Sam to continue to see the light at the end of the tunnel and is reminding him of what he said... It is heartbreaking though.

He's like the star of the football team with a broken leg... only the football game carries the possibility of death if they don't win.

That is such a wonderful analogy. I love it.

Edited at 2014-01-11 07:30 am (UTC)
hells_half_acre
Jan. 11th, 2014 08:28 am (UTC)
What makes Swan Song different from Season 5? Maybe the fact that in Season 5, Sam felt guilty for bringing Lucifer back in the first place? but Dean felt guilty for starting the Apocalypse too?? So is it because because they both felt they had to make things right? Dean sacrificed his need for Sam and Sam sacrificed himself for humanity?

Well, I can only give you my personal opinion - to me, it's really only Sam who felt guilty and felt that he needed to atone for what he had done. Dean acknowledged his roll in the apocalypse, and perhaps he too was driven in PART by a need to make things right... but I think going with Sam's plan of trapping Lucifer was more about seeing Sam as an equal and an adult who could make his own decisions. It was about realizing that it really was the only way - that Sam needed to do it both to save 2/3rds of the world AND to get rid of the guilt he felt.

I think Dean is actually playing along with this. He may not know where Sam is going with it, but I think Dean is "acting" too.

I kind of disagree? I think Dean didn't know what Sam was doing at first, but kind of clued in that he was doing SOMETHING... at one point, I think it's when Sam starts lying, Dean just short of shuts up, and I think that's the point where he started playing along with Sam.

I think this is also what he means in the previous statement about 1000 children dying. It's not actually the children dying, it is the "pain" that Zeus feels equaling 1000 children dying.

Or maybe loosing 1000 worshippers?

Someone else pointed this out too, and I also believe that Sam's feelings of "letting Dean down" and Dean choosing others over him were part of that as well.

Hmmm...yes, I think so too. Especially because when I wrote that line you quoted, it made me think about mental-illness and how that's basically how depression kills you, if fucks with your ability to believe you can survive it... and, I wouldn't be surprised if there was a component of depression alongside Sam's physical ailments, and depression can make you start doubting things, or not believing things, including how much your loved ones love you.

That is such a wonderful analogy. I love it.

Thanks! I thought it was a bit silly myself, so I'm glad it didn't feel that way to you!
supernutjapan
Jan. 11th, 2014 10:23 am (UTC)
Sorry for the long comment and thanks for your answers!

I guess with Swan Song too they had no choice but to be involved in some way because of the roles they were expected to play and the ability they had (to be vessels), while with Season 8 they had a choice.

Yeah, the loss of worshipers would have been the pain that Zeus felt, I think.

Re whether Dean knows what Sam is up to or not - I guess that is up to personal opinion, but I've been thinking that after working with each other for so long, it wouldn't just be physical reflexes that have synchronized but also mental.

All those times when Dean says something inappropriate to someone and Sam kind of looks at him in exasperation? I'm beginning to think that they are not him being insensitive, but being the "bad cop" in a way - so that Sam can get the info out of them.

In this case, it was obviously dangerous for Sam to make a god angry but Dean drawing the god's attention by saying something (anything) might have made it easier for Sam. Anyway, that's just my looking at things with cloudy dean-love glasses maybe ... but, if it was true, that would be pretty cool.
hells_half_acre
Jan. 11th, 2014 05:25 pm (UTC)
Good point about Swan Song vs. S8 and the different levels of their involvement. Swan Song was very much about an inescapable destiny, but S8 was complete free will.

You might be right about Dean. I do think that Dean tries to take attention away from Sam whenever he thinks monsters are getting too angry with Sam - and it's true that they've been working together long enough that they probably recognize when one of them is working a con... I mean, Dean knew right at the beginning of the episode that Sam was acting cagey, so it fits.
( 9 comments — Leave a comment )